Hello everyone, Hello Peter.
I checked yesterday taht keying via hamlib "b" command works great with my Elecraft (and probarly with many other modern TRX's that have keyer onboard). So are they posibility to add this function to CQRlog ?? It's ona cable less in hamshack :-), and it's work similiar to WINkeyer, they accept ASCII code, and in any moment You can interrput transmitting by touch key plugged to radio.
Mon, 2015-08-03 08:22
#1
CW keying via hamlib.
Both K3 and KX3 works similar. CW can be generated either through the hamlib b command or by entering the appropriate command entry directly over serial link. Any touch of a keyer connected to the rig will stop any message sent over the serial link, ie effectively stopping any automatic keying. As far as I can understand this behaviour is similar to eg K1EL keyer, but when using a K3 or a KX3 no extra box is needed. Keying via b command is nice solution.
Alternative is to use cwdaemon, which can be made to work nicely, but keying can not be halted unless keyer is connected to pc.
73 de Olaf - LA3RK
Olaf Devik LA3RK
Olaf I know its nice solution, as an contestman i'm allways look for nice and clean solutions so im waiting impatiently for implementation of this functionality. Less stuff means less things that can dissapoint you during contest or regular dx-ing.
I'm really wonder why so many modern radios dont have USB port or offer limited functionality despite USB standard is quite old. Ham guys will be really comfotable when they will be have possibility to plug one cable and have everything: audio in both directions, keying and CAT, only few models can do that.
I have tested to key my KX3 via the USB interface, ie by issuing KY commands to the KX3. Works like a charm, N1MM reads VFO, mode etc at the same time can generate nice cw via the macros in N1MM. Any touch to the paddle connected to the radio stops any ongoing message received via the usb/serial link.
I have not checked speed changes within a message.
Hamlib has the same functionality either by using the b command or a command to issue KY msg; to the radio.
However, this is not important for myself as CQRLOG is for all normal logging and not contesting. I never use CQRLOG cw functionality.
73 de Olaf - LA3RK
Olaf Devik LA3RK
Hi Petr,
if you use 'CW fx keys' to the CQ call (QSK / BK), it would be nice if you could cancel the call with a separate function key if necessary.
Perhaps one can supplement this possibility.
73, Wolfgang
DL2KI
Esc stops sending at least with my winkey emulating arduino keyer.
Have you tesed it?
--
Saku
OH1KH
Hello OH1KH,
the CW function I usually do not use, as I give in normal CW operation rather with the hand.
Now I have once tried, however, which possibilities the function makes possible. Here I noticed that the transmission can not be canceled. The ESC key does not work.
The keys F1 - F10 and PgUp / PgDn also do not work. The keys can only be activated with mouse click.
The cause can however also depend on the system (Linux Mint KDE 18.2, 64bit).
73, Wolfgang
DL2KI
Yep. You are right.
I have forgotten that keys do not work when focus is set to "cw keys" form.
That is why I added quite long ago buttons PgUp PgDn after F5 and F10 as I wanted to adjust speed with mouse.
How ever it should not be very complicated to either add "esc" button or
make keyboard work when focus is on "cw keys".(actually that would make extra buttons I added unneeded).
I'll keep it in mind (in case Petr does not fix it before :) .
--
Saku
OH1KH
--
Saku
OH1KH
Hi Saku,
i think that a button to abort the broadcast would be useful in principle. It can also be that a technical problem requires an immediate termination.
Today I used the CW-keying function with a test loop for the RBN once to check the 60m bandmap spots. For this application seems to me to be quite well suited.
73, Wolfgang
DL2KI
I can't see any advantage of this keying method. Using my Tinykeyer (http://www.ok1rr.com/index.php/technical-topics/122-the-tinykeyer, compatible with K1EL's Winkey USB, tested both with the same results) I have the same CW timing for both paddle and computer keying. BTW the hamlib keying without paddle input is a way to profane the CW Art and should be (in my humblest opinion) NOT supported in any way.
73,
Martin, OK1RR
Art or not, using "CW keys" to launch the basic messages is very comfortable.
If you have only 100W and OCF and you are trying new DXCC, sometimes even one hour (for nothing) launching call with mouse click is the most ergonomic way. (note: wireless mouse needed).
Same with contest usage, very handy as you can make macros to reply for stations you get with CQ.
With poor fingers and wrists mouse is sometimes easier to handle than keyboard or pads.
So I do not see any reason why it should be dropped away.
I do have Arduino keyer (K3NG) with 3 memories but I do not use them as the box is too far to reach and the button feeling is uncomfortable.
For cw artists: just do not populate memories and do not open "cw keys" form.
Use your stright key. Its the art, not iambic keyers. :)
--
CU (also on CW sometimes)
Saku
OH1KH
--
Saku
OH1KH
Hi Martin,
this is also my opinion. I work almost exclusively in CW and generally use no computer keying, and i think "CW is made by human hand, never from a keyboard."
But the 'programming' of a test loop to test the bandmap in the RBN or to check the spread of the antenna is done quickly and comfortably with the 'CW fx keys' ;). But you can do the same with the CW-Memory in the keyer.
However, since Hamlib keying was built into CQRLog, there will also be a demand. And surely this function is also used by some. If one rejects this, it would be consistent to remove the Hamlib keying completely from CQRLog. I would not miss that.
73, Wolfgang
DL2KI
I operate almost exclusively CW, mostly 30+ WPM. I prefer DX chase and contesting but also long rag chew QSO with friends. The rig is Elecraft K-Line, my K3 has the new KSYN3A boards and should be QSK capable up to 100 WPM. The QSK capability at higher speeds is very important to me. My CW setup is very simple: a Tinykeyer on the USB port does it all. Using Fx keys quite intensively - the F1 key with my call is used for calling, it is not a rare moment F1 must be pressed 100x to reach a good QSO :-) Macros on Fx keys are quite comfortable with the disadvantage that you can hear (through your QSK) that the station answers but your macro still runs. With K3NG we spent a lot of time to minimize the keyer response time when needed to 'cut' down the running macro. The paddle input has a big advantage that your action is immediate - no delays, no macro rests, no garbage.
My "CW Fx keys" strategy: if expecting an early QSO (need few times to call),using paddle exclusively. For an "expedition of year" (need a hour of calling or so to get a QSO) using my F1 :-( Having always a bad feelings while using macros although my keyer has a very fast response to any paddle touch while playing macros from F-keys. For contesting TR4W is used with the same keyer on the same USB port, no need to change anything...
File:
I note the original question why we can not key our Elecraft rigs by use of the rigctl "b" command, evolved into a discussion of using an external box like the Tinykeyer, Winkeyer or similar. Maybe fine for a permanent station setup, but not in a portable situation where one tries to limit the number of boxes to carry around and connect.
But eg the KX3 has the necessary functionality built in and it would be a nice addition to be able to key the rig directly from CQRLOG without the use of an extra box between the pc and the rig.
It seems that some expects that this functionality will evolve into a "keying by keyboard", maybe fine for some, but I think most of us like to use the manual way of generating cw. But for the occasional contest, a direct keying from the log program would be fine.
73 de Olaf - LA3RK
Olaf Devik LA3RK
HI !
Why can't you?
I'm bulding just (long project among the others) cat interface for TS50 using ESP12e WiFi microcontroller.
It has inside iambic keyer and rigctld command emulation so that I can use it without any wire using WiFi.
One of the emulation commands is "b" and other "set L" that can be used for setting cw speed.
I have tested it with cqrlog using "preferences/cw interface/HamLib".
Start rigctld alone from command line with needed parameters and add parameter "-vvvvv" . Start cqrlog with settings "not starting rigctld at startup" and "cw interface/Hamlib"
Then press cw macro and look at the console window. You should see something like:
rigctl(d): b 'currVFO' 'cq cq de OF1KH OF1KH k' '' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '24' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '26' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '28' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '30' ''
rigctl(d): b 'currVFO' 'cq cq de OF1KH OF1KH k' '' ''
Command "L" comes from increase/decrease cw speed.
As hamlib settings are same for rig1, and cw interface/hamLib, commands should go to radio already.
So what is the problem?. Maybe Elecraft support in hamlib is configured so that hamlib does not support CW commands for Elecraft ??
While your test setup still runing open another console and make telnet connect to rigctld: telnet localhost 4532
first type small f and enter. If you get current frequency connection is ok.
next, at start of new line type: \dump_caps and enter. Note backslash is the first character of line and there are no spaces.
You should get long list what your rig can do with rigcltd,
One line is: Can send Morse: N it should be "Y", not "N" ( this line is from IC706)
With q enter you can end the telnet session.
If you know your rig can send cw but rigctld says it can't it can be changed with extra parmeter on startup command line or by modifying source code descrption of your rig's model.
What comes to cut down running macro while sending (what ok1rr says) depends how your rig handles the sending procedure.
In my TS50 project a touch of dit or dah paddle halts -b command executing immediately.
So, b-command should work ok from the side of cqrlog already. What was the question :) ?
--
Saku
OH1KH
--
Saku
OH1KH
HI !
Why can't you?
I'm bulding just (long project among the others) cat interface for TS50 using ESP12e WiFi microcontroller.
It has inside iambic keyer and rigctld command emulation so that I can use it without any wire using WiFi.
One of the emulation commands is "b" and other "set L" that can be used for setting cw speed.
I have tested it with cqrlog using "preferences/cw interface/HamLib".
Start rigctld alone from command line with needed parameters and add parameter "-vvvvv" . Start cqrlog with settings "not starting rigctld at startup" and "cw interface/Hamlib"
Then press cw macro and look at the console window. You should see something like:
rigctl(d): b 'currVFO' 'cq cq de OF1KH OF1KH k' '' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '24' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '26' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '28' ''
rigctl(d): L 'currVFO' 'KEYSPD' '30' ''
rigctl(d): b 'currVFO' 'cq cq de OF1KH OF1KH k' '' ''
Command "L" comes from increase/decrease cw speed.
As hamlib settings are same for rig1, and cw interface/hamLib, commands should go to radio already.
So what is the problem?. Maybe Elecraft support in hamlib is configured so that hamlib does not support CW commands for Elecraft ??
While your test setup still runing open another console and make telnet connect to rigctld: telnet localhost 4532
first type small f and enter. If you get current frequency connection is ok.
next, at start of new line type: \dump_caps and enter. Note backslash is the first character of line and there are no spaces.
You should get long list what your rig can do with rigcltd,
One line is: Can send Morse: N it should be "Y", not "N" ( this line is from IC706)
With q enter you can end the telnet session.
If you know your rig can send cw but rigctld says it can't it can be changed with extra parmeter on startup command line or by modifying source code descrption of your rig's model.
What comes to cut down running macro while sending (what ok1rr says) depends how your rig handles the sending procedure.
In my TS50 project a touch of dit or dah paddle halts -b command executing immediately.
So, b-command should work ok from the side of cqrlog already. What was the question :) ?
--
Saku
OH1KH
--
Saku
OH1KH
Saku
I think you are correct. Checked capability of K3/KX3 in hamlib and it states: Can send morse: Y and yes the b command works, but I was missing a command to change speed.
I was not aware of the L command where you listed KEYSPD as parameter. This was the command I was missing in my earlier tests and to get full functionality I needed to send the rig commands directly. I note it revealed itself once I took a deep dive into the hamlib manual.
Corresponding commands on the RS232 link to the K3/KX3 are;
KS024; #Sets speed to 24 wpm
KY*CQ CQ DE LA3RK; #Keys rig with given text, Asterix either blank or W in which case keying is postponed until previous command is executed.
Seems I have been of the understanding that you either key the rig via a separate box, ie tick off the corresponding mark in CQRLOG in the rig setup.
Will need to check your suggestions once I get to the actual rig back home.
Thanks for help.
73 de Olaf - LA3RK
Olaf Devik LA3RK
Hi !
Still back to this. Message chain is so long that it had to be read again from start.
At some point discussion was about keyboard typed cw. That made me test again with similar setup as my last message.
If "hamlib" I.E rigctrld keying is seleceted at preferences/cw_interface then:
Direct keying in "letter mode" works. Every single letter is send as own -b command.
Also with "word mode, first word in letter mode" works. Spaces send the words each as one -b command. First word goes like in "letter mode". Enter does not send and it makes system funny as normally you may think pressing enter will finish sentence but not here.
"Word mode" works, but the first word is left off (bug?) the second and so on are send each word as own -b command.
Also here pressing enter does not send anything. Must avoid usage of enter.
So cqrlog can drive K3 via hamlib/rigctld also in this case as rigctld converts -b commands to KY-commands.
--
Saku
OH1KH
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Saku
OH1KH
Works as planned and everything ok. No extra box needed, ie macros/typing is fine from CQRLOG via rigctld and to my K3. Any touch of the manual keyer stops the keying.
73 de Olaf - LA3RK
Olaf Devik LA3RK